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Cybershaolin
14-11-09, 17:54
Ce texte est écrit en français et je devrais le voir en anglais.

Cybershaolin
14-11-09, 17:55
Je répète:

Ce texte est écrit en français et je devrais le voir en anglais.

Cybershaolin
14-11-09, 17:56
Why do I still see the text in French above when my forum language is set to English here on this forum? I should see the text in English with the little flags no?

Cybershaolin
14-11-09, 18:35
Regarding my question, it's more about knowing if BBCodes can be added automatically or not? I have trouble to understand the concept. I noticed in another thread that you were saying that BBCodes can be added manually or automatically. So, automatically does not mean that I should have seen the little flags in post #1 and #2? I don't get it sorry and I read your post here: http://www.vbenterprisetranslator.com/forum/general-discussions/12-how-does-works-manual-about-multi-language-support.html

vBET
14-11-09, 23:45
Why do I still see the text in French above when my forum language is set to English here on this forum? I should see the text in English with the little flags no?

Because you didn't "tell" that it is in french ;) Here you have fast and easy manual how to do this: http://www.vbenterprisetranslator.com/forum/general-discussions/12-how-does-works-manual-about-multi-language-support.html
In few words - you can set your default language in User CP, or manually describe message by lang BBCode :)

If you want you can even edit your previous messages and add there this BBCode, and magic will happen ;)

vBET
14-11-09, 23:50
Regarding my question, it's more about knowing if BBCodes can be added automatically or not? I have trouble to understand the concept. I noticed in another thread that you were saying that BBCodes can be added manually or automatically. So, automatically does not mean that I should have seen the little flags in post #1 and #2? I don't get it sorry and I read your post here: http://www.vbenterprisetranslator.com/forum/general-discussions/12-how-does-works-manual-about-multi-language-support.html

lang BBCode is added automatically according to user default language. If it is not set or is same as forum language, then nothing is set.

Google has possibility to recognize language according to message, but because of performance reason we do not do this - also we didn't investigate this Google feature. If you think it could be helpful, then please write about it here Feature Requests - vBulletin Enterprise Translator (vBET) (http://www.vbenterprisetranslator.com/forum/feature-requests/) - we can always add such feature with possibility to turn off and on :)

Cybershaolin
15-11-09, 07:45
lang BBCode is added automatically according to user default language. If it is not set or is same as forum language, then nothing is set.


But that is the problem.

OK look, here on your own forum, my language is set to English... so my text in Posts #1 and #2 (are is in French) are different than the forum language (in my userCP). So, why is my text still in French? Are you saying I have to add the BBcode manually? Then if it's the case, why are you talking about BBcode being added automatically?

I might not understand it correctly but I did go to the link you are referring and this is the way I got it. I thought, this was managed automatically without having to write the BBcode myself.

vBET
15-11-09, 14:13
But that is the problem.

OK look, here on your own forum, my language is set to English... so my text in Posts #1 and #2 (are is in French) are different than the forum language (in my userCP). So, why is my text still in French? Are you saying I have to add the BBcode manually? Then if it's the case, why are you talking about BBcode being added automatically?

I might not understand it correctly but I did go to the link you are referring and this is the way I got it. I thought, this was managed automatically without having to write the BBcode myself.

Yes your posts #1 and #2 are in French, but you told the system that it is in English. Thats is why it is not translated.

You have 2 ways of handling messages in different languages.
1st is setting in your User CP default language for your profile. In this case vBET will assume that your messages are in this language and will add lang BBCode automatically. Still you have possibility to tell vBET to not do this for specific message (on each editor for new message will appear additional option to add BBCodes or not - as default set to yes).
2nd is to add it manually.

You are confused because of other article, please read it again carefully it is written:
"automatically mark message of user which set theirs default language other than forum default language"

If you think that some part is unclear, please point it and we will correct it to make it more clear :)

Cybershaolin
15-11-09, 19:57
This is another test in French.

Cybershaolin
15-11-09, 20:10
Yes your posts #1 and #2 are in French, but you told the system that it is in English. Thats is why it is not translated.


Ahhhhh! Now I got it loud and clear. That is the part I did not understand. Now I changed my language for French in Usercp and wrote another test message in French. It works perfectly here. Thanks for taking the time to explain it to me in a simple way.

But on my own forum, my forum language is in French, I also (optional as you said) set my UserCP in French, and I tried writing messages in arabic and italian. The result showed in arabic and italian without translating anything. This is why I still don't understand. It seems not to be working on my forum.

Also, tell me: the language addon (see screenshot) for BBCode (choose or not) when we compose a message and in the Quick answer as well, is this an addon in version 3.1.2 because I still did not upgrade yet and I don't have it in 3.1.1?

vBET
15-11-09, 22:03
Ahhhhh! Now I got it loud and clear. That is the part I did not understand. Now I changed my language for French in Usercp and wrote another test message in French. It works perfectly here. Thanks for taking the time to explain it to me in a simple way.

But on my own forum, my forum language is in French, I also (optional as you said) set my UserCP in French, and I tried writing messages in arabic and italian. The result showed in arabic and italian without translating anything. This is why I still don't understand. It seems not to be working on my forum.

Also, tell me: the language addon (see screenshot) for BBCode (choose or not) when we compose a message and in the Quick answer as well, is this an addon in version 3.1.2 because I still did not upgrade yet and I don't have it in 3.1.1?

It all works as it is designed. It means - mod will add Lang BBCode only when you have set user default language and only this language. If it is not appropriate, you can just tell to not add it in editor.

On all other cases you have to add lang BBCode manually. So you wrote messages in two other languages and you tell the mod that those are in French, but those are not and that is why those were not translated.

Translation of message written in other language will happen only when lang BBCode is added. Otherwise Google get confused and returns just same text (it is like you go to French-English translator and give him text in Polish - he will just give you this text back, because he will not understand it). So adding lang BBCode to message tells the mod to which translator he should go for translation.

Also please note that options to editors are added only if user has set his default language other that forum default language. Otherwise it has no sense because it means that user writes in forum language and there is no lang BBCode to add. So please for test just change your default language to other that forum language and you will see that options will appear in your editors :)

Cybershaolin
16-11-09, 04:22
It all works as it is designed. It means - mod will add Lang BBCode only when you have set user default language and only this language. If it is not appropriate, you can just tell to not add it in editor.

On all other cases you have to add lang BBCode manually. So you wrote messages in two other languages and you tell the mod that those are in French, but those are not and that is why those were not translated.

Translation of message written in other language will happen only when lang BBCode is added. Otherwise Google get confused and returns just same text (it is like you go to French-English translator and give him text in Polish - he will just give you this text back, because he will not understand it). So adding lang BBCode to message tells the mod to which translator he should go for translation.

Also please note that options to editors are added only if user has set his default language other that forum default language. Otherwise it has no sense because it means that user writes in forum language and there is no lang BBCode to add. So please for test just change your default language to other that forum language and you will see that options will appear in your editors :)

OK I got that part too... Only one more question:

When you said this on post #6:

lang BBCode is added automatically according to user default language. If it is not set or is same as forum language, then nothing is set.


Let's give an example:

-My forum language is french
-User own language is spanish but did not set it up in Usercp
-User writes a post in Spanish

Here is the example from the settings above:

Does that mean if user who did not set is own user language (let say it's spanish, but on my forum, the forum will assume it will be french since it is supposed to use forum language when it's not set) and that the forum language is french...? if that user writes in Spanish, we will be supposed to see the BBCode with the translated text in French. Is that it?

Because, if it's not the case and the text in spanish is not translated at all in this example, this goes back to my request here: http://www.vbenterprisetranslator.com/forum/general-discussions/95-request-help-default-language.html :


Really nice product. Thanks again for this hack. :)

I would need help or have a request to do. For new users on the forum, it's OK since they have a field to select their default language but for all existing users, there is no value set, it just puts "Not set". Could you give me a query to execute in order to automatically put a default language instead of "Not set" (in my case it's french for the default value)? This is because even if you put a thread on the forum telling to the users to go modify their information, many of them will not read that thread.

It would be nice if I can change this automatically for my existing users.

Thanks.


You do not have to set default language for your users. If no default language is set, then vBET assumes that it is same as forum language and take no action when new messages are coming (cause those are in forum language) :)

Do you understand what I mean? If this is not possible doing it by query, at least, there should be an option in admincp for admins who would wish to change a specific user language to a desired language...

vBET
16-11-09, 10:50
Thats correct. It works this way.

So assuming you want to add possibility to set user default language by Admin CP - right? :)

Cybershaolin
16-11-09, 15:26
Thats correct. It works this way.

My last post was a little bit long, sorry. In your quote above, is this your answer to my question I asked here:



Example:

-My forum language is french
-User own language is spanish but the user did not set it up in Usercp
-User writes a post in Spanish
-Result post on the forum will be in French with BBCode inserted?

More specifically, is this your answer to the last question?



So assuming you want to add possibility to set user default language by Admin CP - right? :)

Yes, that would be great. Also, it would be nice to add the default language selected by the user showing in their user profile page when we go check their page. That would also be a great addon in order for an admin to find out about user's selected languages.

vBET
16-11-09, 18:46
My last post was a little bit long, sorry. In your quote above, is this your answer to my question I asked here:

More specifically, is this your answer to the last question?

No. Please note that mod always keeps original text (in fact as post content is kept only the original text). So in this scenario post will stay in original (as always) and BBCode will not be added automatically, because user didn't set default language. So at the end it will not be translated, since it is in other language and it says that it is in forum default language.
I will add in TODO list to automatically recognize the language (will be configurable because this will have impact on performance and not everyone will need this).


Yes, that would be great. Also, it would be nice to add the default language selected by the user showing in their user profile page when we go check their page. That would also be a great addon in order for an admin to find out about user's selected languages.

Ok. Added in TODO list:
- Allow to set user default language from Admin CP
- Show user default language in member info.
- Automatically recognize real post message if Google allows to do this by CURL (configurable + emails notice to administrator to check it in case if Google make mistake).

Is it alright? :)

Cybershaolin
17-11-09, 03:29
No. Please note that mod always keeps original text (in fact as post content is kept only the original text). So in this scenario post will stay in original (as always) and BBCode will not be added automatically, because user didn't set default language. So at the end it will not be translated, since it is in other language and it says that it is in forum default language.
I will add in TODO list to automatically recognize the language (will be configurable because this will have impact on performance and not everyone will need this).

It's logical and it follows what I have experimented. This is why I was asking especially for all existing users on my forum, before installing this hack. This has no real impact on the new users registering on the forum since they must choose a default language at the registration process but it has some impact for old users who did not select any default language. If those users writes in their own language, and different from the forum language (without having chosen their default language, which in this case would remain the same as the default forum language) nothing will be translated (unless they add a BBCode manually, but they must know about that...). It's something to tell all my old users to go and set their default language or add a BBCode manually but it's something else assuming they will.

This cleared out my question. Thanks for having clarified that. Yes, it would be great if everything can be detected automatically. Are you sure that this can be achieved?



Ok. Added in TODO list:
- Allow to set user default language from Admin CP
- Show user default language in member info.
- Automatically recognize real post message if Google allows to do this by CURL (configurable + emails notice to administrator to check it in case if Google make mistake).

Is it alright? :)
This sound great. This would help a lot. (at least for me). :)

vBET
17-11-09, 13:32
IThis cleared out my question. Thanks for having clarified that. Yes, it would be great if everything can be detected automatically. Are you sure that this can be achieved?

No :) I'm not sure - I just have in mind that Google can recognize language, but I didn't check yet does this functionality is available by CURL API. Also I do not know how it will behave for really short messages. Or what if Google will not be sure. Or how mod should behave if user has set default language, but Google tells that it is in some other language (I think it will be configurable: trust user, trust Google + send email notification each time when it happens). So it is a little challenge here but we like it :D

Cybershaolin
18-11-09, 05:18
Anyhow, many of these problems or questioning would be cleared out by the impementation of this here: http://www.vbenterprisetranslator.com/forum/feature-requests/114-set-default-language-default-users-who-did-not-do-yet.html :)

So, maybe it would be a good idea to not make things more complicated and remain with the actual way of working, but it's still up to you to go ahead or not...

vBET
20-11-09, 01:34
OK - I know now that It is possible to recognize language by CURL. Also that Google makes mistakes, but is so kind that tells how sure he is about his guess (0 - not at all, 1 - 100%, everything between - you know what).

So at this moment my proposition for this feature is to make it configurable with options:
- Always trust user (best for performance - Google is not asked when new message is coming, all other options will ask Google about real language)
- Always trust Google (Google result is always used as real language - not good for short messages)
- Trust user but ask Google (in such case if there are differences between what user marks and what Google is telling administrator will get email about it)
- Trust Google when result is trust worthy (another parameter will tell how sure Google must be to use his result - i.e. 0.3)

And one more thing - Google will not be asked if user in any place of message set lang BBCode manually.

What do you think about this? :)

Cybershaolin
20-11-09, 02:28
Good idea. :)

vBET
21-11-09, 16:00
OK it is implemented and will be included in vBET 3.2.0 (yes we was planning 3.1.3, but there is too much changes so it will be 3.2.0).

You can test it here. This forum actually has chosen strategy to trust Google when results are at least 10% sure.

So enjoy :)

vBET
21-11-09, 16:14
For example, this message was not marked by me that he is Polish. Either manually or by setting the default language. In short - I lied to vBET claiming that the message is in English, but using language detection vBET he realized that the message is in English only in Polish and marked it properly:)

Cybershaolin
21-11-09, 16:22
Great job. :) Do you have a release date in head? I really need the new version...

vBET
21-11-09, 17:54
Great job. :) Do you have a release date in head? I really need the new version...

Yes we have - today :) We are glad to give fast what our customers need :)

Production is already in progress. It will take up to 2 hours. We need also produce add for vBA Dyna integration to support language detection also there :)

Cybershaolin
21-11-09, 20:33
Wow! Thanks a lot! Great service! :)

vBET
22-11-09, 17:47
OK it is implemented and will be included in vBET 3.2.0 (yes we was planning 3.1.3, but there is too much changes so it will be 3.2.0).

You can test it here. This forum actually has chosen strategy to trust Google when results are at least 10% sure.

So enjoy :)
This is just a test that checks whether the language detection works well with quotes aimed at the new lines.

Cybershaolin
22-11-09, 18:51
OK - I know now that It is possible to recognize language by CURL. Also that Google makes mistakes, but is so kind that tells how sure he is about his guess (0 - not at all, 1 - 100%, everything between - you know what).

So at this moment my proposition for this feature is to make it configurable with options:
- Always trust user (best for performance - Google is not asked when new message is coming, all other options will ask Google about real language)
- Always trust Google (Google result is always used as real language - not good for short messages)
- Trust user but ask Google (in such case if there are differences between what user marks and what Google is telling administrator will get email about it)
- Trust Google when result is trust worthy (another parameter will tell how sure Google must be to use his result - i.e. 0.3)

And one more thing - Google will not be asked if user in any place of message set lang BBCode manually.

What do you think about this? :)

In the options proposed above, what would be the way to choose from when it used to be done the old way before the implementation of this?

vBET
22-11-09, 18:57
In the options proposed above, what would be the way to choose from when it used to be done the old way before the implementation of this?

Always trust user - this way recognition is not made.

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